I Changed My Strategy…Did You?

by Chris Lengquist on November 4, 2007

Chris LengquistI realize we are in different professions, you and I.  But real estate is our common denominator.  So there is probably relevance in what I’m going to ask you:

In April of 2007 I changed my entire real estate strategy.  Did you?

What do I mean?  Let me explain.  March of 2007 was like a nuclear winter for me.  I had three closings set for the end of the month.  For two of the closings I was the buyer’s agent.  For the third I was the seller’s agent.  For all three, there was a different mortgage professional handling the transaction.

All three buyers (including my two) had marginal credit and only marginal business buying more investment property.  But my job is to give advice, not make decisions for people.  They wanted to buy, they had pre-approval letters from reputable lenders in their hands that stated all of them (remember, none knew each other) were more than qualified to purchase these said investment properties with no money down.

Remember the 100% non-owner occupant loans?  Remember March of 2007? 

My first clue that life was about to change came mid-month.  A mortgage professional I know and trust called me to give me a heads up.  Things were changing quickly, he said and he didn’t know if this loan would be able to go or not.  I asked him to keep me updated. 

To make a very long story short for your  benefit, all three loans died a gruesome death.  It was not pretty for the buyers, the sellers or their real estate agents.  And it wasn’t pretty for the mortgage guys who gave out the pre-approval letters, as you might imagine. 

So here comes April 2007.  What was I to do?  Get a job?  (I usually can’t hold one because they are so confining.)  I didn’t want to do that again.  So instead I got honest.  I had been allowing people who really shouldn’t be buying to take up my time.  That had to stop.  I had four kids to feed, put braces on and a retirement to think about someday down the line.  I had to sell homes to investors because I can’t stand “regular” real estate. 

Starting in April 2007 I quit working with marginal loan qualifiers.  Now, I’m not saying that God doesn’t love these people.  These are good people, too.  But good people won’t pay MY mortgage. 

Today, I insist on a pre-qual by one of my lenders.  A minimum of 10% down and a minimum credit score of 700, 720 for the self-employed. 

Now my business is stronger than ever.  Funny thing.  When I made the mental shift my business took off.  I haven’t had a failed closing because of financing since.  Even in this current credit market.  That’s a powerful statement when all you work with is real estate investors. 

Did you make the shift?  Or are you still chasing B or C paper?  (Is that the term?) Again, I’m glad I did.  Now it’s all blue skies and sunshine. 

  • Tony Gallegos
    Chris - This is SUCH an important concept that most people in the mortgage and real estate industry refuse to abide to. My hat is off to you for being a realist and shifting with the market.
  • Welcome back Chris!
  • Tony - Just trying to survive and thrive like everyone else.

    Paul - Thanks. I've actually just been wall to wall. Investors are out in force. Plus kids football, basketball, honors recognitions...
  • A person would think that doing this will hurt your business but it will help you focus on those will actually get to the closing table.
    This also works with loans.....I dont deal with those have BAD CREDIT....not saying I dont do 400 credit scores...but those who have major lates in the last 12-24months. FHA doesnt allow it...so I dont bother with credit repair...just move on with the next person!
  • Great Concept. It would be great to see more Lenders tighten their requirments. Maybe we would have avoided that problems we are facing now. But like you said they too are good people. Obviously you're right on track. I do not think you'll see too many failed transactions with the criteria you've set up!
  • Gina Gardner
    God I hate to feel like a wet blanket, can't help it 'cause I worked for too many lawyers and sued too many Realtors.

    My concern is the borrower's right to financial privacy. The lender can't disclose that info without the borrower's permission, and if an agent wasn't representing me I wouldn't want him / her to have my financials and know what my down payment is or anything else. And I never had a preapproved (as opposed to prequalified) borrower get unapproved based on personal qualifications.

    The sticking point when I've seen deals fall through lately has been that the property doesn't appraise. Do you require that a prospective seller provide you with an appraisal first so that you don't waste your time? Or that he / she has enough equity to be able to lower the price if needed?

    My own credit is excellent, I can afford to pay cash for my next property, and I would be extremely insulted if asked for this info. Plus as we have equal housing stuff to deal with -- if you don't ask every client from rich to scruffy for the same information there would be at least the appearance of impropriety. According to HUD, a Fair Housing violation would be:

    "Set different terms, conditions or privileges for sale or rental of a dwelling"

    So you'd have to get this from everyone and the borrowers have a right to refuse to give it. And if you pass that info along to the seller that's a can of worms I wouldn't open.

    My solution to this would be requiring a very tight timeline regarding prequal, preapproval, and final, binding approval (including appraisal review). Or requiring a huge earnest money deposit so you know they have the funds and then you don't have to ask intrusive questions. Work with lenders who can close quickly and have a history of honoring their approvals.
  • NCM - Understandable. 400? Shouldn't be buying anyway, IMO.

    Jason - Understand this, for much of my younger adult life I wasn't close to a 700 credit score because I made bad decisions and was not responsible with my money. So I'm not being mean. Just practical for my business model.

    Gina - First, I don't ask the buyer's lender if what their credit score is. (If I'm working with the buyer.) I ask the buyer. Many times they'll give their lender permission to talk with me directly. I lay out my reasons and plans for wealth building. You might also not like the fact that I really don't like to work with anyone buying investment property that can't look me in the eye and say he/she has 3 months minimum remaining in reserve...just in case all goes bad.

    I'm not being discriminatory towards anyone. I lay out why they need capital reserves and good credit scores and as far as the 10% minimum, please find a non-owner occ loan that doesn't have that.

    From a seller's perspective before I let a house get tied up I call the buyer's lender. I ask probing questions to get a feel for the buyer's qualifications. No, I don't get credit scores or copies of credit histories. But I can recognize hemming and hawing when I hear it. :) From there I give the seller my impressions and he/she can make their own decisions.

    And as far as equal housing...I treat everyone the same. But let's say you don't have 10% down, you have "marginal credit" by your own admission and you still say you want to buy an investment property. I would just simply say that it is my belief it won't work out for you and I choose not to spend any time on the issue. However, I'd be happy to refer you to an agent that may. Or heck, I'll even show them how to research contract for deeds.

    It's not any different than if a buyer calls and says they just finished bankruptcy, have no down payment and want to buy a house. How much time are you going to spend on that?
  • Gina Gardner
    I stand by my remarks. The lender is the one who gets to ask the questions, and a borrower who's that patently unqualified will get advice on improving his/her chances and be shown the door politely (we don't like wasting time either, ya know?!). But once I've busted my tail to get borrowers' mattress money into a bank account, helped them prove their income and show how they were able to save what they did ( it's required by Fannie that you make every attempt to help these people by the way), and worked with them to get them approved for a loan they can afford I'm not giving out any information to the listing agent other than what's on the approval letter. Because if I did the selling agent would kill me. And because I'd lose a deal. And because people who worked hard to qualify and deserve to would be devastated.
  • Gina,

    I am not going to be upset with you. I understand your point of view. However, I am talking about investing in real estate, not buying a personal home. To me, and I think to many, that's a huge difference. The rules change.

    I have seen the damage and devastation to personal lives and finances when people who never should have been real estate investors got loans they never should have received. They had no credit history (not good anyway), no reserves, no knowledge of what it would take to maintain a property. They bought on speculation and not on sound investment criteria.

    I am proud to say that while you might think me a little eliteist (sp?) or rude, I am not. Also, to this date and to the best of my knowledge, not one person I've helped in 5 years of real estate sales has had a property go into foreclosure. In this market, I think that speaks for itself.

    Now, you have to know that if we are talking about personal home buyers, you'd find me taking a different stand.
  • Gina Gardner
    Hi Chris,

    All is cool. As a lender I have to do what's best for my client (fiduciary responsibility -- and I wish all other lenders had done the same). As a Realtor, you have to do what's best for yours. You can seek info if it helps your client. You won't get it from me unless it's in my borrower's best interest and I have permission to provide it.That's all, folks :)
  • I think a lot of us are adopting this mindset. A lot of the old-timers had this mindset all along--Bawldguy refers to the reserves as a Sominex account.
  • Chris -- I won't say what I'm thinking. :)

    The last time a lender gave my client advice, without MY permission to open his/her mouth, was the last time they ever did a loan for me.

    Chris has forgotten more about investment real estate than most lenders will ever know.

    The last lender who decided to 'advise' one of my clients about a 'better loan' during a tax deferred exchange, got her boss fired.

    That was two years ago, and so far she's cost that office more than $17 Million in loans -- and counting. And that's just from my firm.

    As I was lamenting to Brian Brady the other day, (a lender who IS allowed to speak freely to my clients) there are too many lenders giving advice to investment borrowers. A sentiment with which he, for the most part agreed.

    If Brian has something of value to add, he calls ME, and we talk. He understands he part of the investor's team, a concept made crystal clear to the investor throughout.

    I work with lenders who are consummate professionals, and understand they're doing business with an experienced pro.

    They do the loan, get paid, and move on.

    Financial privacy? Give me a break. The first thing sacrificed by an investment client is at least a small amount of their financial privacy. Chris ADVISES investors, who, for the most part, use him as a result of their own judgment of their inferior knowledge and skill levels.

    I'm gonna stop now before I really get going.

    Gina, you're not a wet blanket at all. You're something entirely different. Thanks for the heads-up.
  • Sara Brady
    Chris,
    Great blog! Quick question--how are you weathering the current downturn in the housing market? Can you talk a little more about your experience?
  • Well, I just put up $1,080,000 on the sales board for December. I'm not bragging. Just stating fact. I will probably put another 2-3 properties up on the board before the end of November.

    The housing slump is to the benefit of the clients I advocate for. Rents are up. Vacancies are down. Sellers are nervous. Perfect.
  • Get the chalk! GET THE CHALK!!

    Put me on that Cadillac board!
  • Paul - What does that mean?
  • It's a movie reference to a Jack Lemmon line. Chris, one of those things that's only funny if you saw it...
  • Glengarry Glen Ross? If that's the reference, which I remember now that it is, it's funny. The timing is unbelieveable, in fact. I just referenced it on my other blog. www.bbqcapital.com.
  • You got it my friend! And an alternative title to this article could have been:

    "No More Loans for Bruce and Harriet Nyborg"

    Glad you're back, Chris. We've really got a great mix of professionals on this blog.
  • Chris has hit the nail on the head; when the sales market is down, watch out landlords, the tenants are out and looking.

    Most individuals get nervous, will my home sell, will I have to come to closing with more money?

    Why? Lease the home for a couple of months, years, whatever suits your style, gain the equity and place it for sale again when the market is back up.

    Win/win situation
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